Specific product question

[Emy10]

I like the finish effect of the Fresh Coconut lip balm, the one in the jar.

It has a pearlescent finish that i love.

I would like to know if the Fresh Advanced Therapy (tube) has the same finish, or if its just a sheer shine.

I read in the reviews that the Advanced Therapy is more "oily", than the jar balm. 

Please let me know your experience comparing the 2 about the finish (also if its more hydrating), thank you 😃😃😃

[Ispend2much6]

@Emy10   Fresh has a Sugar Wonder Drops Lip Primer; I wonder if using that under the Sugar Advanced Therapy Treatment Lip Balm would help you achieve your goal. 

I was using the Sugar Lip Serum Advanced Therapy under their balm tubes last winter and thought it worked well.  This has a little bit of shine to it.

The Advanced Therapy Balm also comes in a pretty pink shade called "Dream." 

fresh Sugar Wonder Drops Lip Primer 0.16 oz/ 5 mL 

fresh Sugar Advanced Therapy Treatment Lip Balm Dream 

fresh Sugar Lip Serum Advanced Therapy 0.3 oz/ 10 mL 

[Emy10]

@CookieGirl1 thank you very much for your reply Cookie, i agree with you about the jar balms, they dont stay on the lips long, and i even found that the more i was using it, that it was making my lips dry. 

I looked into it and read/watched reviews online, and it seems that certain ingredients over time can dry the lips... and that even if theyre "known" to be hydrating, they can do that (here im thinking they may be using those ingredients on purpose too.....) 😒

Its sad because i love the finish.., ive been looking for other balms with a similar finish, and found nothing so far. 

I might give it another chance, but would not use it everyday, and might also put a more hydrating base first and then put the jar balm on.

The things we do when we like things.... 😌

[CookieGirl1]

@Emy10 I'm sorry that it's really the product finish that you like.  I actually LOVE the formulation of the stick balms--I know perfectly well what you mean about some products purposely containing ingredients known to actually dry the lips over time--and I've definitely done the research to verify that these balms DON'T contain those specifically drying ingredients.  However, if the visual effect is really your goal over the hydration, these may disappoint you.  

[Emy10]

It seems like certain people dont like to be corrected. Seems like, i could be wrong.

I replied to @CookieGirl1 , but my reply was deleted/removed maybe was marked as spam, because its not there anymore.

So, to let people know about those ingredients that are "known" to be hydrating/moisturizing, but that can also be drying, ill post it again:

Ingredients like: fragrance, Beeswax, olive oil, castor oil, and others can be drying.

They can be drying and allergenic; fragrance can sensitize the skin making it easier to develop issues/reactions.

Of course this doesnt happen to everyone, but researchs have proven that a good number of people have issues.

Fresh has plenty of ingredients that people can react to, so im not sure what research you made @CookieGirl1 .

Im saving this post in case it gets deleted.

[WinglessOne]

@Emy10  Without getting into a big ol' deep dive of Fresh Sugar Advanced Therapy Treatment Lip Balm's ingredients list, I doubt all those ingredients you listed are drying. 

Example: castor oil is an emollient and occlusive water-binding ingredient. That’s why it’s in so many moisturizing products. Like any other ingredient, it can cause sensitivity for some people’s skin, and I’m sure some folks are truly allergic to it. (Heck, I’m allergic to benzoyl peroxide.) But I’ve never heard a doctor or chemist call it drying. 

Note that “allergy” and “irritant” are not the same thing: 

Spoiler

My skin’s very sensitive to several ingredients (glaring at you, lavender extract & oil), but the only one I’m truly allergic to is benzoyl peroxide. Most folks who are sensitive to benzoyl peroxide have an irritated skin reaction, usually an explosion of little bumps and redness. But some people, like me, have an allergic reaction that usually includes swelling, extreme itchiness (beyond the typical skin irritation itch) and, in severe cases, closed airway/shortness of breath and low blood pressure. 

I realize many folks use “allergic to” and “sensitive to” interchangeably; I’ve done it myself a few times. But I suspect more folks are sensitive to things like castor oil than truly allergic to it—and I don’t know how common castor oil sensitivity is (compared to other ingredient sensitivities). Next time I can see my dermatologist, I might ask him. 

Fragrance components (linalool, various essential oils, etc.) can cause irritation, and some folks are allergic to them. I'm not sure if they cause dryness, though... My skin hates nearly all essential oils, but my irritation reaction is much more about inflammation (red itchy bumps or hives) than dryness. 

Again, I haven't done a thorough study session on the ingredients in that Fresh balm to look up actual studies and reports, ask doctors for input, and generally corroborate my findings. But @CookieGirl1 's probably not off the mark when she says this balm doesn't contain drying ingredients. It contains some potentially irritating ingredients for sure, but irritation =/= dryness or allergy. 

[Emy10]

@WinglessOne look it up.

I would be suprised if those people that did the researchs lied, but ok. 

Also, i guess that because english is my second language, that when i say "drying" like that, that people take it literally instead of generally. 

I did mentionned "reaction" and "sensitivity" a few times, but i guess i should have added "those situations can make your lips dry".

Ill repeat again what i said, that those ingredients are known to hydrate and moisturize, but now ill add this to clear things, "depending on your situation/reaction to the ingredient, it could result with drier lips". 

In a way there's a few things that you mentionned that i already said earlier, but you gave more details and with a perfect English.

I hope its clearer now lol

[WinglessOne]

@Emy10  Where did you find the studies that state the ingredients you listed are drying? Can you cite one of the studies you're referencing? (I don't think we can link directly to non-Sephora pages—I mean the ability to do so exists, but I think it's still against BIC rules. But you could just post the name(s) of your reference study or studies.) 

I'm not trying to pick on you or be snarky, or anything like that—though it kinda seems like you're in the defensive snark realm. I'm genuinely curious about this because I enjoy learning things. I'm willing to admit when I'm wrong or mistaken, since I don't take knowledge exchanges personally (unless someone gets quite rude or super snarky with me). I see disagreements as learning opportunities for all parties involved. 

EDIT, now that you've edited the post I last replied to: yeah, sometimes things can get lost in translation. But "drying" is a condition separate from "irritating," and I wasn't sure which of those you really meant. The balm in question does contain some potentially irritating ingredients, but maybe not drying ingredients. Alcohol denat can be drying, for instance. So can salicylic acid, if overused. Fragrance components can be irritating, as can coconut for some folks, so this balm could definitely be irritating for some people. 

[Emy10]

I got information from my dermatologist, also pharmacist, but those researchs were mentionned in an article i found reading about Acutane and other medication.

This will be hard for my English but ill do my best lol

I remember her saying something like that there are ingredients that for them to work or work best, that they need to be be combined with certain other ingredients, because if not, then adverse(not sure if this is the right word) reactions or something like that can happen.

I could not remember the terms; oclusive... emoliant, etc like you said.... there are a few of those that can give people "reactions" depending on the product formulation, as well as people's physionomy(?).

I had annoying acne when i was younguer, and took Acutane, i got curious about skin biology(?) so i read more about what it does, what kinds of ingredients can give reactions, be drying(can) even if they "shoudnt be", how the skin glands are/can be affected, and so for certain people, using certain products will/can give them wtv reaction. 

Ill say again, some of those known to hydrate/moisturize ingredient Can be drying. 

Note that i didnt say they are drying i said can, but i guess tis my English.

Edit: yaasss see lol, its because of my English and also i didnt specify enough, im sorry 😅😅😅 

[Emy10]

@CookieGirl1 im glad the Fresh products works for you.

Thing is, that brand has alot of harsh ingredients that alot of people can and have been having bad reactions to.

Fragrances, beeswax, olive oil, castor oil, etc.

Those ingredients are "known" to be hydrating/moisturizing, but they can also be drying.

Im not sure what research you made, but alot of people think that those ingredients are only good, when studies proove that its not the case.

Anyway, you are lucky that so far you havent experienced any issues 😉

I think i will give the coconut balm another chance, but i will try to combine it with other products, and also wont use it everyday.

[CookieGirl1]

@Emy10 No, the fresh Sugar Advanced Therapy Treatment Lip Balm doesn't have the same finish and while I like the variety of scents in the potted versions better, I find that the stick balms from Fresh actually are MORE hydrating and actually stay on my lips longer than the potted formula.  The potted formula is thinner so on me, at least, it tends to wear off faster.

[Emy10]

🤔🤔🤔

No one tried both?? Hmmmm lol